Elixirs Strings --are Condom strings
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by MIKE 450 » 20 Jan 2009, 16:47
Thanks Ross, yes I'd love to try Newtone-Greypicker told me about these a while back--can't buy them in N.Ireland and I'm a bit iffy about giving my bank card details. Will ask my local music store to order both these --I,ve heard good reports about them.
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by frankhond » 24 Feb 2009, 15:11
I spoke to the owner of guitarpeople, a very nice guitar place in Stockholm (they have their own brand of guitars and strings). He told me that most of the standard string brands are made in a group of factories owned by pakistani families in new york... so much for diversity.
The Elixir situation is that now apparently some guitars are optimized for them - Taylor and Furch are two examples, I happwn to own both. A Furch Bluegrass Series D-32-SM which has a huge, shimmering sound with deep bottom when strung with Elixir nanoweb bronze, but sounds crap with practically everything else (and I have tried a lot of strings on this one).
The second one is a Taylor GA4-12 which comes with the Elixir light gauge nanoweb bronze 12-string set. Taylor explicitly writes on the website that if you want to have your guitar perform "to factory specs" you should use these exact strings.
On my other guitars I can use Martins, Wyres, whatever. On my recent Avalon I have the elixirs which came on it right now but will try everything else as soon as they get old.
I would recommend Wyres phosphor bronzes to everyone, they are coated with some kind of teflon powder which prolongs the life somewhat (but makes your fingers a bit dirty). They are also pretty reasonable in price, especially with the low dollar.
The Elixir situation is that now apparently some guitars are optimized for them - Taylor and Furch are two examples, I happwn to own both. A Furch Bluegrass Series D-32-SM which has a huge, shimmering sound with deep bottom when strung with Elixir nanoweb bronze, but sounds crap with practically everything else (and I have tried a lot of strings on this one).
The second one is a Taylor GA4-12 which comes with the Elixir light gauge nanoweb bronze 12-string set. Taylor explicitly writes on the website that if you want to have your guitar perform "to factory specs" you should use these exact strings.
On my other guitars I can use Martins, Wyres, whatever. On my recent Avalon I have the elixirs which came on it right now but will try everything else as soon as they get old.
I would recommend Wyres phosphor bronzes to everyone, they are coated with some kind of teflon powder which prolongs the life somewhat (but makes your fingers a bit dirty). They are also pretty reasonable in price, especially with the low dollar.
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by MIKE 450 » 24 Feb 2009, 16:32
Great post frankhond, great to hear more string news. I must admit I may have went over the top slightly about Elixir's but I did say they where a good string.
I think the packet I bought may have sounded dead because the D string broke, which was just before a gig.That coupled with the FACT that these strings are so expensive sparked me of.
I can't help thinking that Elixirs are so over priced, six steel strings coated with whatever should cost £6-00 MAX not £12-00. As I said before someone somewhere is feeding on the idea that guitarist will only want the best string on there guitar "and thats fine I agree" but the reality is there not the best string--they are a good string.
So while the hunt goes on for the best string"and I must agree this is a personal thing" let's also think about the price.
And when you read frankhonds post carefully notice what he has so kindly told us
The Elixir situation is that now apparently some guitars are optimized for them - Taylor and Furch are two examples, I happwn to own both. A Furch Bluegrass Series D-32-SM which has a huge, shimmering sound with deep bottom when strung with Elixir nanoweb bronze, but sounds crap with practically everything else (and I have tried a lot of strings on this one).
The second one is a Taylor GA4-12 which comes with the Elixir light gauge nanoweb bronze 12-string set. Taylor explicitly writes on the website that if you want to have your guitar perform "to factory specs" you should use these exact strings.
It's very clear to me that Taylor have struck a deal with Elixir "IF YOU WANT TO HAVE YOUR GUITAR PREFORM TO FACTORY SPECS" WHAT A LOAD OF ---- I sometimes wonder are there still people out there who believe all this marketing crap. These guys are laughing all the way to the bank. I can say this when I spoke to Tommy Emannuel on this subject he didnet like or use coated strings nor does Gordan Lightfoot.
We are talking about guitar strings here, yes we all want a good sound but don't let people pee down your back and tell you it's raining.
I think the packet I bought may have sounded dead because the D string broke, which was just before a gig.That coupled with the FACT that these strings are so expensive sparked me of.
I can't help thinking that Elixirs are so over priced, six steel strings coated with whatever should cost £6-00 MAX not £12-00. As I said before someone somewhere is feeding on the idea that guitarist will only want the best string on there guitar "and thats fine I agree" but the reality is there not the best string--they are a good string.
So while the hunt goes on for the best string"and I must agree this is a personal thing" let's also think about the price.
And when you read frankhonds post carefully notice what he has so kindly told us
The Elixir situation is that now apparently some guitars are optimized for them - Taylor and Furch are two examples, I happwn to own both. A Furch Bluegrass Series D-32-SM which has a huge, shimmering sound with deep bottom when strung with Elixir nanoweb bronze, but sounds crap with practically everything else (and I have tried a lot of strings on this one).
The second one is a Taylor GA4-12 which comes with the Elixir light gauge nanoweb bronze 12-string set. Taylor explicitly writes on the website that if you want to have your guitar perform "to factory specs" you should use these exact strings.
It's very clear to me that Taylor have struck a deal with Elixir "IF YOU WANT TO HAVE YOUR GUITAR PREFORM TO FACTORY SPECS" WHAT A LOAD OF ---- I sometimes wonder are there still people out there who believe all this marketing crap. These guys are laughing all the way to the bank. I can say this when I spoke to Tommy Emannuel on this subject he didnet like or use coated strings nor does Gordan Lightfoot.
We are talking about guitar strings here, yes we all want a good sound but don't let people pee down your back and tell you it's raining.
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by Ross A » 24 Feb 2009, 22:13
How on earth would you make a guitar to suit a certain brand of string? Strings are strings. Coated strings last longer and are smoother, but they lose out on tone. The high price also makes you think they have to be good. They are a good string, but there are better, cheaper, strings out there. That's just my opinion!
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by Lentin » 24 Feb 2009, 22:54
Good thread!!
Many years ago I tried Earthwood, from Ernie Ball. Since then, I used them for years, for the 12 and for the 6 string.
With Avalon, the first set was D'Addario and very good, but I wanted to try some others.
Newtone, different D'Addario...
Now I have EJ16. I cant' find any bright at all.
Newtone? I didn't like it.
My conclusion?
There are good strings to be used in gigs (I suppose, I 'play' alone at home), good strings for playing for a long time... and for my eyes.
So, I have not found MY strings yet, but in any case, my L32 sounds like heaven.
Earthwood are 8,50 euro, EJ16 9,50 eur, EJ26 9 eur.
So.... who has MY strings that I can't find them? EH?
Many years ago I tried Earthwood, from Ernie Ball. Since then, I used them for years, for the 12 and for the 6 string.
With Avalon, the first set was D'Addario and very good, but I wanted to try some others.
Newtone, different D'Addario...
Now I have EJ16. I cant' find any bright at all.
Newtone? I didn't like it.
My conclusion?
There are good strings to be used in gigs (I suppose, I 'play' alone at home), good strings for playing for a long time... and for my eyes.
So, I have not found MY strings yet, but in any case, my L32 sounds like heaven.
Earthwood are 8,50 euro, EJ16 9,50 eur, EJ26 9 eur.
So.... who has MY strings that I can't find them? EH?
-
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by frankhond » 24 Feb 2009, 23:12
Ross A wrote:How on earth would you make a guitar to suit a certain brand of string?
I imagine you keep designing the guitar until it sounds great. But the strings you have on the prototypes will obviously affect the tone. IMHO elixirs greatly alter the tone of most guitars. If you design a new guitar model and test it with elixirs (or similar caoted strings) only, I would imagine this would have an impact on how it sounds with non-elixirs.
Of course this is only speculation on my part. But possibly a logical step following the assumption that manufacturers ship guitars with elixirs because they last longer in the shop.
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by MIKE 450 » 25 Feb 2009, 01:05
Ross hit the nail on the head! How on earth would you make a guitar to suit a certain brand of string. The answer is you don't. Imagine for a moment you make guitars, a string company comes along and says" we'll supply you with our new condom strings which last longer.
Think of how much money your going to save, a string company are going to supply you with your strings for nothing. All you have to do is write like Taylor wrote on there website "If you want your guitar to preform to company spec use Elixirs"
Wake up you stupid pluckers Taylor have been making fantastic guitar's long before Elixir came along. My Aavalon sounds good with any type of string on it. When I play a gig I don't get people rushing up to me saying "your guitar sounded fantastic with those Elixirs on it" NO NO NO! they say I loved the sound of your guitar"I'D LOVE AN AVALON MAN!
Strings are only strings ninety nine per cent is in your hands, it helps to have a good guitar thats why --without sounding like I'm endorsed by Avalon "because I'm not" I suggest -if your going to spend good money spend it on a good guitar. And may I add Avalon guitar's dont sound like any other guitar's, it takes a while to get the hang of the rare beautiful sound they produce. But once you find it you'll stick on almost any string and it will sound like an Avalon FANTASTIC---
Think of how much money your going to save, a string company are going to supply you with your strings for nothing. All you have to do is write like Taylor wrote on there website "If you want your guitar to preform to company spec use Elixirs"
Wake up you stupid pluckers Taylor have been making fantastic guitar's long before Elixir came along. My Aavalon sounds good with any type of string on it. When I play a gig I don't get people rushing up to me saying "your guitar sounded fantastic with those Elixirs on it" NO NO NO! they say I loved the sound of your guitar"I'D LOVE AN AVALON MAN!
Strings are only strings ninety nine per cent is in your hands, it helps to have a good guitar thats why --without sounding like I'm endorsed by Avalon "because I'm not" I suggest -if your going to spend good money spend it on a good guitar. And may I add Avalon guitar's dont sound like any other guitar's, it takes a while to get the hang of the rare beautiful sound they produce. But once you find it you'll stick on almost any string and it will sound like an Avalon FANTASTIC---
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by Ross A » 25 Feb 2009, 10:29
Taylor will not have changed anything in their guitar designs to accomodate Elixir strings. It is the guitar that creates the sounds we hear, if it was the strings people wouldn't bother buying high quality guitars.
In my opinion it's totally psychological. One day you might be having an off day with your playing - put it down to the strings. You might not be loving the song you're playing - it's the strings. The atmosphere and acoustics of the room are different - it's the strings!!
There is an element of 'Elixir must be good at that price'. or 'Elixir must be good because Taylor guitars use them, and they wouldn't use any old string'. Like MIKE 450 says, it's all marketing. Elixir DO make good strings, but at the end of the day they are just strings.
These days it just doesn't bother me who made my strings, I do use Newtones if I've got them (or can get some), I will use Martin strings (easily available), I will use D'Addario strings, I'd EVEN use Elixirs if I had a set in my special guitar drawer. If the guitar is good, the strings will do their job.
In my opinion it's totally psychological. One day you might be having an off day with your playing - put it down to the strings. You might not be loving the song you're playing - it's the strings. The atmosphere and acoustics of the room are different - it's the strings!!
There is an element of 'Elixir must be good at that price'. or 'Elixir must be good because Taylor guitars use them, and they wouldn't use any old string'. Like MIKE 450 says, it's all marketing. Elixir DO make good strings, but at the end of the day they are just strings.
These days it just doesn't bother me who made my strings, I do use Newtones if I've got them (or can get some), I will use Martin strings (easily available), I will use D'Addario strings, I'd EVEN use Elixirs if I had a set in my special guitar drawer. If the guitar is good, the strings will do their job.
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by Walesy » 25 Feb 2009, 11:29
Some valid points here, not least that guitar companies will supply their guitars with whatever strings they can get the best deal on!
Fylde guitars come with Elixir strings on, if you read their website Roger Bucknall openly says that he uses Elixir as they last longer which is useful especially in shop conditions.
As for me, I use Elixir and find them to be absolutely fantastic strings, and the reason they cause such a stir in my opinion, is that they're revolutionary. They're very different to any other string i've tried and that makes them a 'marmite' type string (i.e. you'll either love them or hate them!) I pay £10 a set which is a few pound more than other strings (I used to use Martin SP which were around £8 a set) but they're more than worth the extra couple of quid as not only do they last far longer than other strings but they also feel/sound/play far better, in my opinion.
Ultimately, string choice is a very personal thing - quite why people get so wound up over it is beyond me! If you like them, buy them, if you dont then there's plenty of choice available!
Fylde guitars come with Elixir strings on, if you read their website Roger Bucknall openly says that he uses Elixir as they last longer which is useful especially in shop conditions.
As for me, I use Elixir and find them to be absolutely fantastic strings, and the reason they cause such a stir in my opinion, is that they're revolutionary. They're very different to any other string i've tried and that makes them a 'marmite' type string (i.e. you'll either love them or hate them!) I pay £10 a set which is a few pound more than other strings (I used to use Martin SP which were around £8 a set) but they're more than worth the extra couple of quid as not only do they last far longer than other strings but they also feel/sound/play far better, in my opinion.
Ultimately, string choice is a very personal thing - quite why people get so wound up over it is beyond me! If you like them, buy them, if you dont then there's plenty of choice available!
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by MIKE 450 » 26 Feb 2009, 19:26
Yes Walesy if you like em use em, I'll go with that.But!and I'm sorry for harping on about this,when your going to meet the best acoustic guitarist in the world you lie in your bed thinking OK remember to ask him what strings he use's and why.
So there I am shaking hands with Tommy Emanuel,a small crowd of guitarist are listening in waiting to hear the great man speak. HI TOMMY WHAT STRINGS DO YOU USE AND WHY!
Oh I just use the cheapies mate Martins-ARE YOU ENDORSED BY MARTIN--no no they just suit my sound-I get offer's from all the string companys and guitar companys--WHAT ABOUT ELIXIRS STRINGS--you mean condom strings "everyone laughs" I hate coated strings you lose the twang and volume - BUT THERE EASY ON THE FINGER TIPS--yeah yeah there made for fairies- but you won't build up the calluses on your finger tips witch you need ----cut your finger nails right back on both hands--fingernails break and always need repairing--when you play as much as I do you don't want that.
Tommy spoke with use for about a half hour a very nice man--so I suppose you gotta ask yourself--is this very nice Christain man telling porkies NO he's not folks! --I'm trying to imagine Mr Elexir cruising around the Bahamas telling other rich folk how he made the condom string --meanwhile back in the real world working class guitarist are handing over there hard earned cash for he's strings.
It also makes me wonder how did bands like the EAGLES sound so good without coated strings--JOHN DENVER--NIEL YOUNG etc etc the list is so long.--I've nothing against someone spending £4000 on a hand made guitar--when you think of all that hard work and the T.L.C. went into it.
I looked up a guitar string site a while back-they have all the strings you can think of. On this site they play the strings for you so as you can choose with string you like best. They finger pick the strings the they strum and play a little blues number at the end.
My two sons and I ended up in stiches of laughter "and I being very honest here" we had a ball--all of us agreed that there was realy no differents in the sound --maybe I thought because he was using the same guitar who knows!
So there I am shaking hands with Tommy Emanuel,a small crowd of guitarist are listening in waiting to hear the great man speak. HI TOMMY WHAT STRINGS DO YOU USE AND WHY!
Oh I just use the cheapies mate Martins-ARE YOU ENDORSED BY MARTIN--no no they just suit my sound-I get offer's from all the string companys and guitar companys--WHAT ABOUT ELIXIRS STRINGS--you mean condom strings "everyone laughs" I hate coated strings you lose the twang and volume - BUT THERE EASY ON THE FINGER TIPS--yeah yeah there made for fairies- but you won't build up the calluses on your finger tips witch you need ----cut your finger nails right back on both hands--fingernails break and always need repairing--when you play as much as I do you don't want that.
Tommy spoke with use for about a half hour a very nice man--so I suppose you gotta ask yourself--is this very nice Christain man telling porkies NO he's not folks! --I'm trying to imagine Mr Elexir cruising around the Bahamas telling other rich folk how he made the condom string --meanwhile back in the real world working class guitarist are handing over there hard earned cash for he's strings.
It also makes me wonder how did bands like the EAGLES sound so good without coated strings--JOHN DENVER--NIEL YOUNG etc etc the list is so long.--I've nothing against someone spending £4000 on a hand made guitar--when you think of all that hard work and the T.L.C. went into it.
I looked up a guitar string site a while back-they have all the strings you can think of. On this site they play the strings for you so as you can choose with string you like best. They finger pick the strings the they strum and play a little blues number at the end.
My two sons and I ended up in stiches of laughter "and I being very honest here" we had a ball--all of us agreed that there was realy no differents in the sound --maybe I thought because he was using the same guitar who knows!
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by Walesy » 26 Feb 2009, 20:08
Sorry Mike 450, i'm not sure whether my post has come across wrong, but I wasn't saying that 'Elixir are the best strings in the world' - I was saying that we all have varied tastes in all aspects of the guitar, from body size, neck width, action height etc etc etc and strings are a large part of that.
I wouldn't doubt that Tommy Emmanuel doesn't like them for one minute, but that doesn't mean that I have to feel the same. I speak as I find and for me, the revolutionary way in which Elixir nanowebs are made (i.e, the way they put condoms on them!) makes them stand out from other strings in a way that works for me, they sound very bright, last for ages (a big plus for me as it means they work out much cheaper than any other string) and I find that I can glide up and down the fretboard with ease with them - now some guitarists wouldn't like the 'lack of resistance' that comes from the nanoweb coating as to them it takes away the 'feel' of the string, but we all find different things comfortable to play so some will love it and some will hate it.
Tommy Emmanuel has spent his whole life playing guitar, I expect playing guitar comes more naturally to him than even walking so it doesn't surprise me that after 40(?) plus years of playing he's not keen on the feel of a completely new type of string coating.
I'll say it again, all my point is, is that just because one man prefers Elixirs doesn't mean everyone will - choose your string, buy it, fit it, and enjoy it
I wouldn't doubt that Tommy Emmanuel doesn't like them for one minute, but that doesn't mean that I have to feel the same. I speak as I find and for me, the revolutionary way in which Elixir nanowebs are made (i.e, the way they put condoms on them!) makes them stand out from other strings in a way that works for me, they sound very bright, last for ages (a big plus for me as it means they work out much cheaper than any other string) and I find that I can glide up and down the fretboard with ease with them - now some guitarists wouldn't like the 'lack of resistance' that comes from the nanoweb coating as to them it takes away the 'feel' of the string, but we all find different things comfortable to play so some will love it and some will hate it.
Tommy Emmanuel has spent his whole life playing guitar, I expect playing guitar comes more naturally to him than even walking so it doesn't surprise me that after 40(?) plus years of playing he's not keen on the feel of a completely new type of string coating.
I'll say it again, all my point is, is that just because one man prefers Elixirs doesn't mean everyone will - choose your string, buy it, fit it, and enjoy it
- Walesy
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by MIKE 450 » 26 Feb 2009, 20:48
Hi Walesy, no worries mate your post was spot on and thanks for it. I happen to like the bright sound of Elixirs. Apart from having a laugh which I love to do -I just find after 35 years of replacing strings that there's not much differents in the sound of them,but they do differ in price.
I played my first gig over 30years ago and oddly enough no one ever ask me what strings I was useing. To be honest I'd use any string except Rotosound not because they sound bad but because they arent wound at the brigde which makes the top E string rattle.
Mabe I'll make my own strings some day and call them MIKE 450.
Get some of your tunes recorded Walesy so we can all hear ya--if you want to hear my cheap strings click on to my site--pour yourself a drink first--happy picking mate!
I played my first gig over 30years ago and oddly enough no one ever ask me what strings I was useing. To be honest I'd use any string except Rotosound not because they sound bad but because they arent wound at the brigde which makes the top E string rattle.
Mabe I'll make my own strings some day and call them MIKE 450.
Get some of your tunes recorded Walesy so we can all hear ya--if you want to hear my cheap strings click on to my site--pour yourself a drink first--happy picking mate!
- MIKE 450
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by Walesy » 26 Feb 2009, 21:36
Ha! Id like to order the first set of Mike450 strings in advance!
I just had a listen to your stuff, what a great sound you've got! I have no means of recording at home, was yours done at home and if so did your set up cost much if you dont mind me asking?
Great stuff!
I just had a listen to your stuff, what a great sound you've got! I have no means of recording at home, was yours done at home and if so did your set up cost much if you dont mind me asking?
Great stuff!
- Walesy
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by MIKE 450 » 26 Feb 2009, 22:39
Yeah thanks for that Walesy my first customer--I record in my friends studio. I don't believe in all this home recording stuff. Mine you I do recomend a cassette recorder for recording idea's. the quality isnt much good but it tells the truth.
I think being a singer/songwriter/guitarist is enough for any anyone to get there head round--leave the recording for those who are realy into it.
As I said not to long ago to Dale Warner, recording at home can cause hassle, your home is for loving and putting your feet up. Check out Dales site beautiful guitar playing.
It's like practicing --I use an old empty swimming pool to practice in that way I don't annoy my wife and kids-although I still tinker around with the guitar at home. But I never wanted to get to a point where I'd go into a bad mood if my wife or kids walked into a practice session. I'm so lucky to have them and anyway music should always be fun--when it's not it's time for the guitar to go out the window.
My idea is play songs- guitarist come and go songs last forever--My recordings are simple I record live and leave the mistakes "organic" And I must stress everyone should record there's a lot to learn from listening to yourself and even more to learn by letting others listen and give there veiws. So get cracking Walesy you'll be ten times the musician for it.
I think being a singer/songwriter/guitarist is enough for any anyone to get there head round--leave the recording for those who are realy into it.
As I said not to long ago to Dale Warner, recording at home can cause hassle, your home is for loving and putting your feet up. Check out Dales site beautiful guitar playing.
It's like practicing --I use an old empty swimming pool to practice in that way I don't annoy my wife and kids-although I still tinker around with the guitar at home. But I never wanted to get to a point where I'd go into a bad mood if my wife or kids walked into a practice session. I'm so lucky to have them and anyway music should always be fun--when it's not it's time for the guitar to go out the window.
My idea is play songs- guitarist come and go songs last forever--My recordings are simple I record live and leave the mistakes "organic" And I must stress everyone should record there's a lot to learn from listening to yourself and even more to learn by letting others listen and give there veiws. So get cracking Walesy you'll be ten times the musician for it.
- MIKE 450
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